From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 1 16:08:31 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Robin Becker) Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2012 16:08:31 +0100 Subject: [ltp] thinkpad_ec fails on T430i Message-ID: <5069B1EF.5000104@chamonix.reportlab.co.uk> Apologies if this is a repost, but I can't see my initial message an hour after the confirmation. I have a recent T430i with 1.20 bios and have installed Arch Linux on it. I have fan control working, but cannot get thinkpad_ec (or tp_smapi) working. The message is similar to this one https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=845442 (sorry, but I am at work and don't have the machine with me) I tried the tpacpi-bat perl script workaround for setting the battery thresholds, but that fails with an error return of 0x8000000.. at the acpi_call. Looking in the journalctl output I can see that some bios ranges appear to conflict with things that thinkpad_ec wants. Is this something that can be fixed using a modified DSDT? Do all of these problems vanish if I use EFI rather than legacy MBR booting? This is my first thinkpad and I like it (don't like the caps lock key though or Fn-Ctrl positioning). IBM had(has) a good linux rep, but looking in various forums seems Lenovo is leaving that behind. -- Robin Becker From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Tue Oct 2 13:04:05 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Noritoshi Yoshiyama) Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 20:04:05 +0800 Subject: [ltp] Noritoshi Yoshiyama is out of the office. Message-ID:

I will be out of the office starting  2012/09/29 and will not return until 2012/10/05.

I will respond to your message when I return. From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 1 12:52:08 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Robin Becker) Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2012 12:52:08 +0100 Subject: [ltp] thinkpad_ec fails on T430i In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <506983E8.9020707@chamonix.reportlab.co.uk> Apologies if this is a repost, but I can't see my initial message an hour after the confirmation. I have a recent T430i with 1.20 bios and have installed Arch Linux on it. I have fan control working, but cannot get thinkpad_ec (or tp_smapi) working. The message is similar to this one https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=845442 (sorry, but I am at work and don't have the machine with me) I tried the tpacpi-bat perl script workaround for setting the battery thresholds, but that fails with an error return of 0x8000000.. at the acpi_call. Looking in the journalctl output I can see that some bios ranges appear to conflict with things that thinkpad_ec wants. Is this something that can be fixed using a modified DSDT? Do all of these problems vanish if I use EFI rather than legacy MBR booting? This is my first thinkpad and I like it (don't like the caps lock key though or Fn-Ctrl positioning). IBM had(has) a good linux rep, but looking in various forums seems Lenovo is leaving that behind. -- Robin Becker From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 1 11:23:56 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Robin Becker) Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2012 11:23:56 +0100 Subject: [ltp] thinkpad_ec fails on T430i Message-ID: <50696F3C.60808@chamonix.reportlab.co.uk> I have a recent T430i with 1.20 bios and have installed Arch Linux on it. I have fan control working, but cannot get thinkpad_ec (or tp_smapi) working. I tried the tpacpi-bat perl script workaround for setting the battery thresholds, but that fails with an error return of 0x8000000.. at the acpi_call. Looking in the journalctl output I can see that some bios ranges appear to conflict with things that thinkpad_ec wants. Is this something that can be fixed using a modified DSDT? Do all of these problems vanish if I use EFI rather than legacy MBR booting? This is my first thinkpad and I like it (don't like the caps lock key though or Fn-Ctrl positioning). IBM had(has) a good linux rep, but looking in various forums seems Lenovo is leaving that behind. -- Robin Becker From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Sat Oct 6 17:44:22 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (=?UTF-8?B?SmFuIEt1bmRyw6F0?=) Date: Sat, 06 Oct 2012 18:44:22 +0200 Subject: [ltp] thinkpad_ec fails on T430i In-Reply-To: <50696F3C.60808@chamonix.reportlab.co.uk> References: <50696F3C.60808@chamonix.reportlab.co.uk> Message-ID: <50705FE6.70208@gentoo.org> On 10/01/12 12:23, Robin Becker wrote: > don't like the caps lock key though or Fn-Ctrl positioning There's a BIOS setting for swapping the Fn-Ctrl positions. Cheers, Jan -- Trojita, a fast e-mail client -- http://trojita.flaska.net/ From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 8 04:28:45 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Bert Haskins) Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2012 23:28:45 -0400 Subject: [ltp] Hibernate on older thinkpads Message-ID: <5072486D.9020203@chartermi.net> FWIW I have a couple of A31s that I still use for special purposes. I have lots of other newer toys of course but the A31s just seem to go on forever. These would hibernate nicely until somewhere around Ubuntu Hardy and then after a system update they would hibernate and never return, requiring a reboot. I tried lots of fixes, other distros, etc with no joy. Then, after a new trial Mint 13 install full hibernation seems to be back! and it is very welcome. This was < not > sent from my Ipad or smartphone... it was sent from a A31 which has relearned to hibernate. From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 8 11:50:57 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Robin Becker) Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2012 11:50:57 +0100 Subject: [ltp] thinkpad_ec fails on T430i In-Reply-To: <50705FE6.70208@gentoo.org> References: <50696F3C.60808@chamonix.reportlab.co.uk> <50705FE6.70208@gentoo.org> Message-ID: <5072B011.9030004@chamonix.reportlab.co.uk> On 06/10/2012 17:44, Jan Kundrát wrote: > On 10/01/12 12:23, Robin Becker wrote: >> don't like the caps lock key though or Fn-Ctrl positioning > > There's a BIOS setting for swapping the Fn-Ctrl positions. > > Cheers, > Jan > thanks, I've just noticed that this is the same on my MSI-winds so I'll just adjust. I'm having trouble getting three things to work under Arch linux on the T430. finger print reader waiting on a proprietary driver update from Upek/Authentec battery charging control & hdaps waiting on thinkpad_ec/tp_smapi. I looked in the dmidecode output and don't see any reference to Embedded Controller, but the DSDT certainly has most of the tables. Is there somewhere to post this detailed output so some work can go on to support these later thinkpads? -- Robin Becker From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Wed Oct 10 22:32:24 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Rubin Abdi) Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2012 14:32:24 -0700 Subject: [ltp] X220 power tricks with 3.2 kernel Message-ID: <5075E968.4040204@starset.net> $ uname -a Linux lines 3.2.0-3-amd64 #1 SMP Mon Jul 23 02:45:17 UTC 2012 x86_64 GNU/Linux Currently I'm using i915.i915_enable_rc6=1 which gave me about a 20% - 30% boost in battery performance. Recently with some dist-upgrade I haven't seen that sort of boost as often (or just haven't been paying attention). Anyhow, anyone got any new kernel options to squeeze out more power? -- Rubin rubin@starset.net From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 15 13:04:18 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Martin Steigerwald) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 14:04:18 +0200 Subject: [ltp] Hibernate on older thinkpads In-Reply-To: <5072486D.9020203@chartermi.net> References: <5072486D.9020203@chartermi.net> (sfid-20121008_092314_252642_D636857F) Message-ID: <201210151404.18600.Martin@lichtvoll.de> Am Montag, 8. Oktober 2012 schrieb Bert Haskins: > FWIW > I have a couple of A31s that I still use for special purposes. > I have lots of other newer toys of course but the A31s just seem to go > on forever. > These would hibernate nicely until somewhere around Ubuntu Hardy and > then after a > system update they would hibernate and never return, requiring a > reboot. I tried lots of fixes, other distros, etc with no joy. > Then, after a new trial Mint 13 install full hibernation seems to be > back! and it is very welcome. > > This was < not > sent from my Ipad or smartphone... it was sent from a > A31 which > has relearned to hibernate. Can you tell kernel versions? I have a ThinkPad T23 that hibernates and resumes just nicely with 3.3, but not with 3.4 and 3.5. With those newer kernels it hangs upon resume. Ciao, -- Martin 'Helios' Steigerwald - http://www.Lichtvoll.de GPG: 03B0 0D6C 0040 0710 4AFA B82F 991B EAAC A599 84C7 From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 15 13:40:27 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Frank Baumeister) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 14:40:27 +0200 Subject: [ltp] how to activate wifi on startup Message-ID: <507C043B.5050108@web.de> Hello, when I start my x121e the wifi is deactivated. Is this TLP? And how to activate it on startup? Regards Frank Baumeister From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 15 13:58:54 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Richard Neill) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:58:54 +0100 Subject: [ltp] how to activate wifi on startup In-Reply-To: <507C043B.5050108@web.de> References: <507C043B.5050108@web.de> Message-ID: <507C088E.1010904@richardneill.org> On 15/10/12 13:40, Frank Baumeister wrote: > Hello, > when I start my x121e the wifi is deactivated. Is this TLP? And how to > activate it on startup? There are lots of different controls for the Wifi - some of which try to "helpfully" remember your previous state. The fundamental controls are: Hardware kill switch (if physically fitted) (see: rfkill) Firmware kill switch (Fn-F5, or Bios) The actual radio settings (Access Point, Authorisation, DHCP). There are several underlying frameworks (the kernel, network manager, nm-applet, wicd, wpa-supplicant, /etc/network/interfaces). Also possibly the firmware. It's all a horrible distro-dependent mess - so many things are trying to help, that the simple task you are trying to do is complicated. If you reply with which distro, which desktop-environment, and the type of network you're using, I may be able to help more. At a guess though: 1. You're using network manager and haven't got it automatically enabled. 2. You should do a clean logout and shutdown while the wifi is enabled and connected to your AP, to encourage everything to remember that state. 3. When it's not working, try "rfkill list" and post the result. HTH Richard From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 15 14:40:11 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Frank Baumeister) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 15:40:11 +0200 Subject: [ltp] how to activate wifi on startup In-Reply-To: <507C088E.1010904@richardneill.org> References: <507C043B.5050108@web.de> <507C088E.1010904@richardneill.org> Message-ID: <507C123B.4010303@web.de> Hello, thank you but I already solved it: I set RESTORE_DEVICE_STATE_ON_STARTUP=1 in /etc/default/tlp with friendly regards Frank Baumeister From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 15 16:12:24 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Adrian Walker) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 11:12:24 -0400 Subject: [ltp] how to activate wifi on startup In-Reply-To: <507C123B.4010303@web.de> References: <507C043B.5050108@web.de> <507C088E.1010904@richardneill.org> <507C123B.4010303@web.de> Message-ID: --14dae934061f034c9504cc1a77b6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi Frank, Which distro are you running please? Thanks, -- Adrian On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 9:40 AM, Frank Baumeister wrote: > Hello, > thank you but I already solved it: > I set > RESTORE_DEVICE_STATE_ON_**STARTUP=1 > in /etc/default/tlp > > with friendly regards > Frank Baumeister > > -- > The linux-thinkpad mailing list home page is at: > http://mailman.linux-thinkpad.**org/mailman/listinfo/linux-**thinkpad > --14dae934061f034c9504cc1a77b6 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Frank,

Which distro are you running please?

=A0=A0=A0=A0= =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 Thanks,=A0 -- Adrian

On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 9:40 AM, Frank Baum= eister <baumeisterf@web.de> wrote:
Hello,
thank you but I already solved it:
I set
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0RESTORE_DEVICE_STATE_ON_STARTUP=3D1
in /etc/default/tlp

with friendly regards
Frank Baumeister

--
The linux-thinkpad mailing list home page is at:
http://mailman.linux-thinkpad.org/mailman/listi= nfo/linux-thinkpad

--14dae934061f034c9504cc1a77b6-- From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 15 17:21:22 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Frank Baumeister) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 18:21:22 +0200 Subject: [ltp] how to activate wifi on startup In-Reply-To: References: <507C043B.5050108@web.de> <507C088E.1010904@richardneill.org> <507C123B.4010303@web.de> Message-ID: <01d7e4fc-2454-4b0a-a3b6-5e930ebc7794@email.android.com> It's Ubuntu 12.04. Adrian Walker schrieb: >Hi= Frank, > >Which distro are you running please? > > Th= anks, -- Adrian > >On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 9:40 AM, Frank Baumeister >wrote: > >> Hello, >> thank you but I already solved it: >>= I set >> RESTORE_DEVICE_STATE_ON_**STARTUP=3D1 >> in /etc/default/t= lp >> >> with friendly regards >> Frank Baumeister >> >> -- >> The linux-th= inkpad mailing list home page is at: >> >http://mailman.linux-thinkpad.**or= g/mailman/listinfo/linux-**thinkpad >> -- Diese Nachricht wurde von meinem Androi= d-Mobiltelefon mit K-9 Mail gesendet. From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 15 18:38:01 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Bert Haskins) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 13:38:01 -0400 Subject: [ltp] Hibernate on older thinkpads In-Reply-To: <201210151404.18600.Martin@lichtvoll.de> References: <5072486D.9020203@chartermi.net> (sfid-20121008_092314_252642_D636857F) <201210151404.18600.Martin@lichtvoll.de> Message-ID: <507C49F9.1000606@chartermi.net> On 10/15/2012 08:04 AM, Martin Steigerwald wrote: > Am Montag, 8. Oktober 2012 schrieb Bert Haskins: >> FWIW >> I have a couple of A31s that I still use for special purposes. >> I have lots of other newer toys of course but the A31s just seem to go >> on forever. >> These would hibernate nicely until somewhere around Ubuntu Hardy and >> then after a >> system update they would hibernate and never return, requiring a >> reboot. I tried lots of fixes, other distros, etc with no joy. >> Then, after a new trial Mint 13 install full hibernation seems to be >> back! and it is very welcome. >> >> This was < not > sent from my Ipad or smartphone... it was sent from a >> A31 which >> has relearned to hibernate. > Can you tell kernel versions? > > I have a ThinkPad T23 that hibernates and resumes just nicely with 3.3, > but not with 3.4 and 3.5. With those newer kernels it hangs upon resume. > > Ciao, uname says: 3.2.0-23-generic #36-Ubuntu SMP I am going to freeze it at this, i.e. no further updates. I don't want a update to mess this up again. From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 15 21:21:50 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Philipp Kern) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 22:21:50 +0200 Subject: [ltp] USB 3.0 breakout with dock on non-USB 3.0 laptop Message-ID: <20121015222150.0ad07b40@simplex.0x539.de> --Sig_/.R_Rg5=ojnxLhXexpIFZlof Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, I own a T420 which does not support USB 3.0 on its own. Now Lenovo came out with a new dock that does provide one single USB 3.0 port. Can somebody confirm that the port works even though the laptop itself does not provide one? If it does work I presume it's some kind of PCIe connection over the proprietary dock connector to a USB 3.0 chip in the dock, i.e. a new controller in lspci? Kind regards Philipp Kern --Sig_/.R_Rg5=ojnxLhXexpIFZlof Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJQfHBeAAoJEERuJUU10FbsM1MIAJvryTo9xbx9OhxLzTHoR0Ui 1VmXfxUQ7tetEUW4N4AI4tETa2WXVFd9KM5L6v7cnCWsI8I2fC/E+gSntRKt2v68 oWLhfWWYGQ40uTQivOT4isySsR/RmaQhZhHXc5qAEtAj5CkB1gsQ6WSSWg0ZY9nO zVbr0IuLlvIokOW43fpkv7kbFsGcM1Yz5FKpW7Z5ofWrw29py67Vuqxe9zQwaCKT KwHL5oot15c+Od3wA4q8vGmUYk0Pg4AM4B0yM1MS6IvjzihRPAQ4+kM8OmlCpHzI sAA35Ju5M7RIq9oX+MlkflNvenvQtDdT6SIqLl9fpXtOyCoB32HqZALvIK/K6YE= =UvQX -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/.R_Rg5=ojnxLhXexpIFZlof-- From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Tue Oct 16 08:26:27 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Marius Gedminas) Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 10:26:27 +0300 Subject: [ltp] how to activate wifi on startup In-Reply-To: <01d7e4fc-2454-4b0a-a3b6-5e930ebc7794@email.android.com> References: <507C043B.5050108@web.de> <507C088E.1010904@richardneill.org> <507C123B.4010303@web.de> <01d7e4fc-2454-4b0a-a3b6-5e930ebc7794@email.android.com> Message-ID: <20121016072627.GA24341@platonas> --17pEHd4RhPHOinZp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 06:21:22PM +0200, Frank Baumeister wrote: > It's Ubuntu 12.04. Where does /etc/default/tlp come from? http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?searchon=3Dcontents&keywords=3D%2Fetc%2Fd= efault%2Ftlp&mode=3Dexactfilename&suite=3Dprecise&arch=3Dany yields no results. Context: > Adrian Walker schrieb: >=20 > >Hi Frank, > > > >Which distro are you running please? > > > > Thanks, -- Adrian > > > >On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 9:40 AM, Frank Baumeister > >wrote: > > > >> Hello, > >> thank you but I already solved it: > >> I set > >> RESTORE_DEVICE_STATE_ON_**STARTUP=3D1 > >> in /etc/default/tlp > >> > >> with friendly regards > >> Frank Baumeister Marius Gedminas --=20 A: No. Q: Should I include quotations after my reply? --17pEHd4RhPHOinZp Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFQfQwjkVdEXeem148RAtN4AJ0fC2LZobElJGaJlO+qLnqEVvXppQCfU6s5 pTMKOxoeUyHP1vxLWg+fncI= =f4BB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --17pEHd4RhPHOinZp-- From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Tue Oct 16 10:17:19 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Frank Baumeister) Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 11:17:19 +0200 Subject: [ltp] how to activate wifi on startup In-Reply-To: <20121016072627.GA24341@platonas> References: <507C043B.5050108@web.de> <507C088E.1010904@richardneill.org> <507C123B.4010303@web.de> <01d7e4fc-2454-4b0a-a3b6-5e930ebc7794@email.android.com> <20121016072627.GA24341@platonas> Message-ID: <507D261F.8070802@web.de> Am 16.10.2012 09:26, schrieb Marius Gedminas: > Where does /etc/default/tlp come from? Hello, TLP it's a power managment tool for thinkpads. Have a look at http://linrunner.de/en/tlp/docs/tlp-linux-advanced-power-management.html or https://launchpad.net/~linrunner/+archive/tlp From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Tue Oct 16 12:00:48 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Evgeni Golov) Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 13:00:48 +0200 Subject: [ltp] USB 3.0 breakout with dock on non-USB 3.0 laptop In-Reply-To: <20121015222150.0ad07b40@simplex.0x539.de> References: <20121015222150.0ad07b40@simplex.0x539.de> Message-ID: <20121016110048.GO14677@dorei.kerker.die-welt.net> Hi, On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 10:21:50PM +0200, Philipp Kern wrote: > I own a T420 which does not support USB 3.0 on its own. Now Lenovo came > out with a new dock that does provide one single USB 3.0 port. Can > somebody confirm that the port works even though the laptop itself does > not provide one? If it does work I presume it's some kind of PCIe > connection over the proprietary dock connector to a USB 3.0 chip in the > dock, i.e. a new controller in lspci? AFAIK it does not even work on USB3.0 enabled models under Linux. At least thats what I've heard from a friend and his X230 plus dock. Greets Evgeni -- Bruce Schneier can read and understand Perl programs. From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Fri Oct 19 01:27:57 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (andy Rife) Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2012 17:27:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [ltp] ***SPAM*** Message-ID: <1350606477.17997.YahooMailNeo@web113717.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> ---573980257-2049003897-1350606477=:17997 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii http://imprintpixels.com/wp-content/plugins/akismet/friendsnews.php?standard262.img ---573980257-2049003897-1350606477=:17997 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii ---573980257-2049003897-1350606477=:17997-- From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Sun Oct 21 12:46:37 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Markus Schulz) Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2012 13:46:37 +0200 Subject: [ltp] x1c and to sensitive touchpad Message-ID: <201210211346.37565.msc@antzsystem.de> hello, i have some trouble with the touchpad on my thinkpad x1 carbon running debian/wheezy. Each tap-to-click creates additional motion events beyond the buttonevent and therefore the cursor moves a bit around. i've tried to play with the following values HorizHysteresis = 8 VertHysteresis = 8 FingerLow = 25 FingerHigh = 30 MaxTapTime = 180 MaxTapMove = 235 but without luck. any further ideas? my current settings: # synclient -l Parameter settings: LeftEdge = 1766 RightEdge = 5384 TopEdge = 1640 BottomEdge = 4500 FingerLow = 25 FingerHigh = 30 FingerPress = 256 MaxTapTime = 180 MaxTapMove = 235 MaxDoubleTapTime = 180 SingleTapTimeout = 180 ClickTime = 100 FastTaps = 0 EmulateMidButtonTime = 0 EmulateTwoFingerMinZ = 282 EmulateTwoFingerMinW = 7 VertScrollDelta = 107 HorizScrollDelta = 107 VertEdgeScroll = 0 HorizEdgeScroll = 0 CornerCoasting = 0 VertTwoFingerScroll = 1 HorizTwoFingerScroll = 1 MinSpeed = 1 MaxSpeed = 1.75 AccelFactor = 0.0373134 TrackstickSpeed = 40 EdgeMotionMinZ = 30 EdgeMotionMaxZ = 160 EdgeMotionMinSpeed = 1 EdgeMotionMaxSpeed = 428 EdgeMotionUseAlways = 0 TouchpadOff = 2 LockedDrags = 0 LockedDragTimeout = 5000 RTCornerButton = 0 RBCornerButton = 0 LTCornerButton = 0 LBCornerButton = 0 TapButton1 = 1 TapButton2 = 3 TapButton3 = 2 ClickFinger1 = 1 ClickFinger2 = 3 ClickFinger3 = 2 CircularScrolling = 1 CircScrollDelta = 0.1 CircScrollTrigger = 1 CircularPad = 0 PalmDetect = 1 PalmMinWidth = 10 PalmMinZ = 200 CoastingSpeed = 20 CoastingFriction = 50 PressureMotionMinZ = 30 PressureMotionMaxZ = 160 PressureMotionMinFactor = 1 PressureMotionMaxFactor = 1 GrabEventDevice = 1 TapAndDragGesture = 1 AreaLeftEdge = 0 AreaRightEdge = 0 AreaTopEdge = 0 AreaBottomEdge = 0 HorizHysteresis = 8 VertHysteresis = 8 ClickPad = 1 RightButtonAreaLeft = 3575 RightButtonAreaRight = 0 RightButtonAreaTop = 4133 RightButtonAreaBottom = 0 MiddleButtonAreaLeft = 0 MiddleButtonAreaRight = 0 MiddleButtonAreaTop = 0 MiddleButtonAreaBottom = 0 regards, msc From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Thu Oct 25 08:09:47 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (David Griffith) Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 00:09:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [ltp] New 6-row keyboard scaring me off Message-ID: Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard 7-row keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and after what I've seen from Lenovo and their attitude towards users about this, I'm thinking of jumping ship. Here's an example of what I'm talking about: http://blog.lenovo.com/products/why-you-should-give-in-to-the-new-thinkpad-keyboard -- David Griffith dgriffi@cs.csubak.edu A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail? From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Thu Oct 25 13:25:06 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 08:25:06 -0400 Subject: [ltp] New 6-row keyboard scaring me off In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <50892FA2.6080600@rogers.com> David Griffith wrote: > Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard 7-row > keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and after what > I've seen from Lenovo and their attitude towards users about this, I'm > thinking of jumping ship. Here's an example of what I'm talking > about: > http://blog.lenovo.com/products/why-you-should-give-in-to-the-new-thinkpad-keyboard > That's hardly new and I don't see what the problem is. The E520 I bought last year has that sort of keyboard. The top row is used for both the usual function keys and special functions. By default, the function keys require pressing the "Fn" key, but it's easy enough to change the configuration so that the special functions require that instead. From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Thu Oct 25 13:37:27 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Evgeni Golov) Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 14:37:27 +0200 Subject: [ltp] New 6-row keyboard scaring me off In-Reply-To: <50892FA2.6080600@rogers.com> References: <50892FA2.6080600@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20121025123727.GA19301@dorei.kerker.die-welt.net> On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 08:25:06AM -0400, James Knott wrote: > David Griffith wrote: > >Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard > >7-row keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and > >after what I've seen from Lenovo and their attitude towards users > >about this, I'm thinking of jumping ship. Here's an example of > >what I'm talking about: http://blog.lenovo.com/products/why-you-should-give-in-to-the-new-thinkpad-keyboard > > > > That's hardly new and I don't see what the problem is. The E520 I > bought last year has that sort of keyboard. The top row is used for > both the usual function keys and special functions. By default, the > function keys require pressing the "Fn" key, but it's easy enough to > change the configuration so that the special functions require that > instead. Well, that is okay for me. But I have a L520 here, with the 6row keyboard and the following points suck: - PageUp/PageDown are near the arrow keys, not in the upper right corner - the Insert/Delete/Home/End buttons are in a terriby wrong order (in one row...) Just my 0.02€ Evgeni -- Bruce Schneier can read and understand Perl programs. From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Thu Oct 25 09:33:38 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org) Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 10:33:38 +0200 Subject: [ltp] New 6-row keyboard scaring me off In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 25 October 2012 09:09, David Griffith wrote: > > Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard 7-row > keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and after what I've > seen from Lenovo and their attitude towards users about this, I'm thinking > of jumping ship. Here's an example of what I'm talking about: > http://blog.lenovo.com/products/why-you-should-give-in-to-the-new-thinkpad-keyboard > I'm with you on this one. Their reasoning is clear but this should have been a case of "if ain't broke don't fix it" - I've never heard anyone complain about the original ThinkPad keyboards. And why is everyone adopting chiclet-style keyboards nowadays? Not everything Apple does should be copied mindlessly, you twats. From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Thu Oct 25 10:16:27 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Dmitry E. Mikhailov) Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 15:16:27 +0600 Subject: [ltp] New 6-row keyboard scaring me off In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1351156587.22156.2.camel@ibm2> On Thu, 2012-10-25 at 00:09 -0700, David Griffith wrote: > Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard 7-row > keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and after what I've > seen from Lenovo and their attitude towards users about this, I'm thinking > of jumping ship. Here's an example of what I'm talking about: > http://blog.lenovo.com/products/why-you-should-give-in-to-the-new-thinkpad-keyboard That sucks. Really sucks. I'm on it from an X41. I don't even need a thinklight to type because I've learned it. That sucks. Dmitry From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Sat Oct 27 14:03:33 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Marius Gedminas) Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2012 16:03:33 +0300 Subject: [ltp] New 6-row keyboard scaring me off In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20121027130333.GB4248@platonas> --uZ3hkaAS1mZxFaxD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 10:33:38AM +0200, rappard@dds.nl wrote: > On 25 October 2012 09:09, David Griffith wrote: > > > > Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard 7-row > > keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and after what I've > > seen from Lenovo and their attitude towards users about this, I'm think= ing > > of jumping ship. Here's an example of what I'm talking about: > > http://blog.lenovo.com/products/why-you-should-give-in-to-the-new-think= pad-keyboard > > > I'm with you on this one. Their reasoning is clear but this should > have been a case of "if ain't broke don't fix it" - I've never heard > anyone complain about the original ThinkPad keyboards. /me raises hand cautiously I was never very happy about the position of Esc and F1 on the original keyboard. It caused me to get :help on Vim almost every time I wanted to press Esc, for weeks, until I created a mapping to turn F1 off. Also, I was never happy about the original position of Fn and Ctrl. There's a reason they gave in and added a BIOS option to swap them in the end. (And no, I never used that option -- I got used to the original weird order over the many years of ThinkPad use.) > And why is everyone adopting chiclet-style keyboards nowadays? > Not everything Apple does should be copied mindlessly, you twats. > Marius Gedminas --=20 We've found by experience that people who are careless and sloppy writers a= re usually also careless and sloppy thinkers (often enough to bet on, anyway). -- ESR (http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html) --uZ3hkaAS1mZxFaxD Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFQi9ulkVdEXeem148RAil5AJ0btpaXJpsitw+YpGT3D4L+0CmgPwCfS8f9 Rv3IiFlNHRFp6+s3OiMo/ys= =y9G3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --uZ3hkaAS1mZxFaxD-- From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Sat Oct 27 00:04:46 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org) Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 16:04:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [ltp] Re: Linux-Thinkpad digest, Vol 1 #3187 - 2 msgs In-Reply-To: <20121026100100.A783F34165@parabel.matrix.de> References: <20121026100100.A783F34165@parabel.matrix.de> Message-ID: > Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 14:37:27 +0200 > From: Evgeni Golov > To: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org > Subject: Re: [ltp] New 6-row keyboard scaring me off > Reply-To: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org > > On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 08:25:06AM -0400, James Knott wrote: >> David Griffith wrote: >>> Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard >>> 7-row keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and >>> after what I've seen from Lenovo and their attitude towards users >>> about this, I'm thinking of jumping ship. Here's an example of >>> what I'm talking about: http://blog.lenovo.com/products/why-you-should-give-in-to-the-new-thinkpad-keyboard >>> >> >> That's hardly new and I don't see what the problem is. The E520 I >> bought last year has that sort of keyboard. The top row is used for >> both the usual function keys and special functions. By default, the >> function keys require pressing the "Fn" key, but it's easy enough to >> change the configuration so that the special functions require that >> instead. > > Well, that is okay for me. But I have a L520 here, with the 6row > keyboard and the following points suck: > - PageUp/PageDown are near the arrow keys, not in the upper right > corner > - the Insert/Delete/Home/End buttons are in a terriby wrong order (in > one row...) > > Just my 0.02??? > Evgeni > Keyboards on thinkpads have been getting progressively worse. My X24 still has the nicest thinkpad keyboard with the arrow keys physically seperated and no stupid windows keys. The new keyboard has some terrible attributes. Printscreen button in the bottom row is totally non-sensical. The pageup/down buttoms being seperate from the home/end buttons make absolutely no sense even by their logic -- curor positioning. Moreover I used to take out the springs from the ridiculous browser back/forward buttons so that there would be some arrow key seperation again, but now I can't do that since I need the pageup/down buttons... what I really want in life is my existing old school thinkpad keyboard in bluetooth, but no luck there... argh -alan From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Sat Oct 27 15:55:44 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Ricardo Reis) Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2012 15:55:44 +0100 (WEST) Subject: [ltp] New 6-row keyboard scaring me off In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Oct 2012, rappard@dds.nl wrote: > I'm with you on this one. Their reasoning is clear but this should > have been a case of "if ain't broke don't fix it" - I've never heard > anyone complain about the original ThinkPad keyboards. Although I like the classic keyboard and agree with you, you also have to ask, "It ain't broken from who's perspective?" One thing is the user, other questions of market and manufacturability. I don't think people have the full knowledge to say, if they were employed at Lenovo and was their turn to make the call, what the answer would be. Maybe you would be surprised with yourself. best regards from a classic thinkpad keyboard user (X220) Ricardo Reis -- PhD/MSc Mechanical Engineering | Lic. Aerospace Engineering http://www.flickr.com/photos/rreis/ contacts: gtalk: kyriusan@gmail.com skype: kyriusan - email sent with alpine 2.00 - From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Sat Oct 27 16:49:14 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Chow Loong Jin) Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2012 23:49:14 +0800 Subject: [ltp] Re: New 6-row keyboard scaring me off In-Reply-To: <50892FA2.6080600@rogers.com> References: <50892FA2.6080600@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 25/10/2012 20:25, James Knott wrote: > David Griffith wrote: >> Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard 7-row >> keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and after what I've seen >> from Lenovo and their attitude towards users about this, I'm thinking of >> jumping ship. Here's an example of what I'm talking about: >> http://blog.lenovo.com/products/why-you-should-give-in-to-the-new-thinkpad-keyboard >> > > That's hardly new and I don't see what the problem is. The E520 I bought last > year has that sort of keyboard. The top row is used for both the usual function > keys and special functions. By default, the function keys require pressing the > "Fn" key, but it's easy enough to change the configuration so that the special > functions require that instead. I've got an E220S, and while what you describe sounds fine and dandy, the firmware is so broken that F7/F8 send duplicate keystrokes each, and if you configure the BIOS to change the Fn key behaviour, it reverts back after a day or so. -- Kind regards, Loong Jin From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 29 12:19:59 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 08:19:59 -0400 Subject: [ltp] Re: Linux-Thinkpad digest, Vol 1 #3187 - 2 msgs In-Reply-To: References: <20121026100100.A783F34165@parabel.matrix.de> Message-ID: <508E746F.1040208@rogers.com> chekov@alum.wpi.edu wrote: > what I really want in life is my existing old school thinkpad keyboard > in bluetooth, but no luck there... > argh What we need are the good old IBM type M keyboards built into a ThinkPad. Those keyboards are great. They're solid, work well and feel right. I'm using one right now on my desktop system. From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 29 14:20:14 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Florian Reitmeir) Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 15:20:14 +0100 Subject: [ltp] New 6-row keyboard scaring me off In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <508E909E.9090600@reitmeir.org> David Griffith wrote: > Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard 7-row > keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and after what I've > seen from Lenovo and their attitude towards users about this, I'm > thinking of jumping ship. Here's an example of what I'm talking about: > http://blog.lenovo.com/products/why-you-should-give-in-to-the-new-thinkpad-keyboard i sold one, and used it while installing the machine, and must say i like it better than the keyboard of the x220. typing is very OK but there are other advantages too, like * no space under the key, so nothing can stick there * much simpler to clean * lighting from the key-bottom * more silent while typing -- Florian Reitmeir E-Mail: florian@reitmeir.org Tel: +43 650 2661660 From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Mon Oct 29 15:05:06 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (Stefan Monnier) Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 11:05:06 -0400 Subject: [ltp] Re: New 6-row keyboard scaring me off References: Message-ID: > Is anyone else annoyed at Lenovo for discontinuing the standard 7-row > keyboard? I've been looking at getting a new laptop and after what I've > seen from Lenovo and their attitude towards users about this, I'm thinking > of jumping ship. Here's an example of what I'm talking about: >From what I can tell, the new keyboard is largely OK (a few pluses and a few minuses, but overall probably just as good, though I haven't had a chance to use them yet). The main problem is the change itself: most/all my various computers (laptops and desktops) have a Thinkpad keyboards. So if I get a new Thinkpad, I'll be back to having to deal with various different keyboards. Luckily, I don't forsee buying a new laptop any time soon. The main reason being that 16:10 was bad enough, but 16:9 is just too painful (either the screen is not tall enough, or if it is, then the machine is much too big to be carried around). In my book, the best laptop screen width is "the width of the keyboard", and its height should be "as high you can without making the laptop's overall size inconvenient". I.e. anywhere between a X200 and a 14" T43 (both have pretty much the same width). So my plan is rather to make my laptops last as much as possible, hoping that either this hole in the market gets plugged, or that my habits change enough. Stefan From linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org Tue Oct 30 13:35:54 2012 From: linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org (linux-thinkpad@linux-thinkpad.org) Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2012 06:35:54 -0700 Subject: [ltp] re: New 6-row keyboard scaring me off Message-ID: <362796d83033e133c6362cacf81a9dde.squirrel@webmail.strucktower.com> This T520 is the first Lenovo I've owned, so I don't have history with these keyboards. I certainly like mine, but I am not a heavy user. I wonder why Lenovo didn't just make the new keyboards an option? Aren't th= e keyboards relatively easy to exchange/replace? Can the new laptops use th= e older keyboards, and vice versa? That imho would have been a better marketing decision. Keith Ostertag